Gabor Matรฉ '..I think the Vietnam War to the Iraq war many major movements in American history have been driven by lies. And, people being manipulated and the same newspapers that will eventually publish the Pentagon Papers and win awards for telling the truth will never apologize for having told the lies in the first place that later on they had to correct. and the newspapers that pushed their weapons of mass destruction narrative never apologized and said we were wrong we contributed to the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people they just carry on as if nothing happened and then the next item comes along they're still signed on to them to the elite narrative...'

ยท 2 ยท 4 ยท 1

Gabor Matรฉ '...along comes a Trump he's egregious he's a highly traumatized utterly self unrestrained troubled schoolyard bully and so it's offensive to the sensitivity the sensibilities of the liberal establishment does somebody like trump represent and yes when it comes to genuine policy there's no difference between these people it's just that the system wants people who can make it more palatable and Trump makes it very unpalatable and so Trump has woken us up but unfortunately a lot of the liberal outrage has been at Trump personally rather than at the policies and rather than at the system that he represents...'

@jd The Iraq war was based on total fabrications. The manipulation was totally cynical, and from 2002 onwards there was quite a substantial fake news industry of talking heads and faked stories bolstering the war. It didn't take long for the WMD narrative to fall apart, because it was based on blurry photos, faked testimonies and tabloid hype.

@bob I am not sure if the narrative totally fell apart, there are still many who prefer to believe...

'...more than half of Republicans โ€” 51 percent โ€” and half of those who watch Fox News โ€” 52 percent โ€” say that they believe it to be โ€œdefinitely trueโ€ or โ€œprobably trueโ€ that American forces found an active weapons of mass destruction program in Iraq...' (2015)

@jd There were some people who wanted to believe that the WMD would some day eventually be located and clung onto that. I think they even sent a team of experts in to find them. But by about 2005 it was clear that the whole thing had been a fake news event and even the True Believers had to reluctantly admit as much.

A lot of the True Believer phenomena I think originated from some people's unwillingness to recognize that political leaders would lie to them in a very cynical manner for purely self-serving reasons and regardless of how much damage that caused. It was like a kind of collective denial.
@jd In the UK in the late 2000s there were a series of Iraq war inquiries to try to "bring to account" the politicians who had tricked the public. Some of the manipulations uncovered were comically bad. Evidence which Colin Powell had described as "exquisite" in a critical UN meeting turned out to be somebody's PhD thesis from 1990 with some words changed to make it sound more contemporary and sinister.

But the inquiries were a whitewash and none of the politicians suffered any repercussions for what they had done. People tried to do a citizens arrest on Tony Blair a couple of times. But in the end they just got away with it. Blair minted a personal fortune out of the subsequent oil deals, but on the rare occasions that he appears in the mainstream media these days he looks like a wraith.
Sign in to participate in the conversation mastodon

A generalistic Mastodon instance hosted in France, open to all and available since the 9 April 2017. Learn about the instance information and guidelines.